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 Train of Thought Mafia
Monsieur
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  Posted Jun 24 2017, 06:53 PM
i decided that i am not feeling them muppets right now, so going for something else

Flavour text:
Welcome to the Train of thought! The train that takes its passengers to every abstract corner your subconscious might have thought of, and then some. There's a bistro, a wagon with games such as pool, black jack etc.

The Train of Thought is empowered and controlled by the thought. We can call it automatic.

It is you and nine other passengers in the train. But what was supposed to be a fascinating ride became a nightmare.

Two individuals have hijacked the Train. Why? Ask them, if you can find them. Then there is that other guy...
End of Flavour.

Roles:
Baddies:
Has BTSC and NK. Can swap the NK for one RID kill, but not two nights in a row.
Mac That - Quite the controlling person. Every night, choose a role and guess what player that role will act on. If successful, that role's action will fail. If successful, Mac That cannot target the same role the following night.

Classic Curbing Mustachioed Monocle Man - He was a super hero once, the famous Monocle Man. He is a shadow of himself now when he has adopted his extremely villainous name. Asks host in BTSC each night "is one of [insert player names] role X. The answer will only be yes or no. Will look like a goodie when faction spied.

Both baddies can be blocked. NK requires a carrier and can therefore be blocked.

ODTG ability:
The hammer - ends the Day prematurely exactly when it has been sent in in the BTSC. However, 12 hours must have gone of the day before used.

WINCON: Gain majority and eliminate Indy.

Goodies:
Coffee Kid - Hangs out in the bistro with a cup of coffee. It makes him speedy. Can send in his vote secretly by PM. This means that his public vote will not be the real one.

ESPecially ESPionage Ester - She claims to have ESP. ODTG ability - send in a PM to prevent the hammer for that Day. Can choose a Day in the future, or the current Day. It needs to be specified.

Gösta Berling - A figment of the imagination that has somehow entered the train. He can't speak English. Believes himself a hero and poet - Block

Villain/Fiend - at odds with everyone since people like calling him a villain or fiend. Which is sad, since he wants to help people. Will be spied as bad. Save.

Gubbey - ??? Okay. Kill. MUST kill on either N1 or N2. If no kill is submitted, Gubbey will die. Gubbey kills a baddie, Gubbey keeps the Kill. If Gubbey targets a goodie, Gubbey will die instead (but it will look like Gubbey killed the player who is Gubbey)

Mademoiselle Que - A fine dame. Magnificient and stuff. Faction spy

Personal Assistant Assistant - The assistant of a personal assistant. A robot. ODTG lynch save.

Wincon: Eliminate baddies and indy

Indy:
Cornflakes - Escaped cereal killer. Serious guy. Wants to steal the Train of Thought to make his final escape. So he needs the Keys. Ability: ODTG Kill. Will get a clue based on the flavour after every NP, on who has the Keys. Kills the player to gain the keys. Is unkillable at N1. Will look like he was saved.
Wins if he gets the keys. Can win if the player holding the keys give them to him. Game ends at Cornflakes' win.

The Keys is an artifact randomly assigned to a player at the start of N1. The player can choose to give away the keys or keep them each Night. If the player is killed, the killer will receive the Keys. If the player is lynched, the Keys will be randomly assigned to a living player (except Cornflakes).



Rules and stuff:
Tie lynch at D1 means no lynch. Any other day and it is a random lynch between the tied players.

Baddies win in a 1 vs 1 scenario.

Eeeh there are most likely more rules to be laid out, but I am tired atm so thoughts on that would be interesting. I chose to have two baddies instead of three because of how many times goodies have to mislynch until lylo. I meant to make this game normal but something happened and here we are. An experiment for tiny but complex game.

I leave it here tbh


I'm an educated man, I read various remarkable books, but I cannot understand the direction I myself want to go, whether to live or to shoot myself, as it were. So, in case, I always carry a revolver about with me. - Epikhodov

And perhaps we are funny. But you must never imagine, that just because something is funny, Monsieur le Marquis, it is not dangerous. - Mr. Croup

I have always felt that violence was the last refuge of the incompetent, and empty threats the last sanctuary of the terminally inept. - Monsieur le Marquis

There is nothing so dangerous for anyone who has something to hide as conversation!... A human being cannot resist the opportunity to reveal himself and express his personality which conversation gives him. Every time he will give himself away. - Agathe Christie
Monsieur
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Posts: 6804
Gender: Male 
Awards: 25

B: 9-8
G: 33-19
I: 3-6
O: 9-11
TB: 2-1
TG: 3-7
  Posted Jun 24 2017, 07:12 PM
OH WHAT SHOWS UP IN THE NP!

That will be for tomorrow http://mafiamaniac.org/smile/cool.gif gotta catch my Z


I'm an educated man, I read various remarkable books, but I cannot understand the direction I myself want to go, whether to live or to shoot myself, as it were. So, in case, I always carry a revolver about with me. - Epikhodov

And perhaps we are funny. But you must never imagine, that just because something is funny, Monsieur le Marquis, it is not dangerous. - Mr. Croup

I have always felt that violence was the last refuge of the incompetent, and empty threats the last sanctuary of the terminally inept. - Monsieur le Marquis

There is nothing so dangerous for anyone who has something to hide as conversation!... A human being cannot resist the opportunity to reveal himself and express his personality which conversation gives him. Every time he will give himself away. - Agathe Christie
lolcat
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TB:
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  Posted Jun 24 2017, 11:43 PM
Why would baddies want to exchange the NK for one RID kill? Is RID unblockable and unsaveable or something?

If the baddies hammer, does it get publicly announced (as soon as you log in to read baddie BTSC) or does the day continue with discussion that only the baddies know is meaningless? If it doesn't get announced right away, would there be any indication in the day post that it was used (if it didn't lead to an impossible lynch victim given the final vote tally anyway)? If the day continues (or if you're slow to log in and end the day), would ESPer's ability prevent a hammering if it's submitted after the hammer is submitted in baddie BTSC?

The fact that the Coffee Kid can screw with the apparent outcome of the lynch vote while the baddies don't have a vote manip makes for unusual mechanics where the goodies might want to have an apparent tie in the lynch votes. I'm not yet sure if that could lead to undesirable effects, but I'll think about it.

I'm slightly wary of forcing Gubbey to kill N1 or N2 with such a small roster since Russel Crow ended pretty quick with two goodie kills, but a forced early kill probably helps with balance since there are only two baddies. Do the Gubbey mechanics only apply to his first kill (on either N1 or N2) and then he's a straight kill if he kills a baddie and therefore survives, or would he still die if he targets a goodie afterward? What happens if Gubbey targets the indy for a kill?

Does the assistant assistant's ODTG lynch save just say “save whoever gets lynched today” or say “stop the lynch if player X (or any of players {X, Y, Z}) are up for lynch”, and if the latter does it kick in if the Coffee Kid's ability changes the outcome from what the roster would suggest, and is anything revealed about the player who would have been lynched?

If player X is holding the keys and chooses to give them away on the same night that the indy targets him for the ODTG kill, does the indy win? If player X chooses to give the keys to a player who gets targeted for the baddie NK that night, does the original player keep the keys or do they go to the baddie NK carrier?

There is also something that I don't want to post publicly about the design so I'll PM you.
Monsieur
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B: 9-8
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TB: 2-1
TG: 3-7
  Posted Jun 25 2017, 08:16 AM
QUOTE (plasmid @ Jun 25 2017, 05:43 AM)
Why would baddies want to exchange the NK for one RID kill? Is RID unblockable and unsaveable or something?

yes, I will specify it. I thought two RID kills would be too OP for a tiny game

If the baddies hammer, does it get publicly announced (as soon as you log in to read baddie BTSC) or does the day continue with discussion that only the baddies know is meaningless? If it doesn't get announced right away, would there be any indication in the day post that it was used (if it didn't lead to an impossible lynch victim given the final vote tally anyway)? If the day continues (or if you're slow to log in and end the day), would ESPer's ability prevent a hammering if it's submitted after the hammer is submitted in baddie BTSC?

The hammer will be publicly announced as soon as I see it.
ESPer needs to send in her hammer prevent before the baddies have hammered.
If she prevents the hammer, it will be mentioned in the DP (which will be posted at the regular end of the day time). The baddies will be told that they failed.


The fact that the Coffee Kid can screw with the apparent outcome of the lynch vote while the baddies don't have a vote manip makes for unusual mechanics where the goodies might want to have an apparent tie in the lynch votes. I'm not yet sure if that could lead to undesirable effects, but I'll think about it.

hmm yeah
My intent was to give the Hammer an additional problem to create mind games.
Coffee Kid could also screw with the Lynch Save.


I'm slightly wary of forcing Gubbey to kill N1 or N2 with such a small roster since Russel Crow ended pretty quick with two goodie kills, but a forced early kill probably helps with balance since there are only two baddies. Do the Gubbey mechanics only apply to his first kill (on either N1 or N2) and then he's a straight kill if he kills a baddie and therefore survives, or would he still die if he targets a goodie afterward? What happens if Gubbey targets the indy for a kill?

I was thinking that Gubbey keeps a regular Kill which he can use whenever and how much he wants to. So he would survive killing a Goodie at that time.
Hmm... I will see that as a non-goodie kill so it'd work like a baddie kill.
Another thing, going with my wordings I have observed this: Gubbey lives if he kills a baddie. That means that it won't count if he gets blocked or the target is saved. Gubbey dies if he targets a goodie. This means that he dies even if he gets blocked or the target is saved. Thoughts on that? It could make Gubbey learn the ID of a baddie/the indy so maybe not good.


Does the assistant assistant's ODTG lynch save just say “save whoever gets lynched today” or say “stop the lynch if player X (or any of players {X, Y, Z}) are up for lynch”, and if the latter does it kick in if the Coffee Kid's ability changes the outcome from what the roster would suggest, and is anything revealed about the player who would have been lynched?

The assistant's assistant needs to specify who they are lynch saving.
And they can only pick one player. That means that if the lynch changes because of Coffee Kid, and AA is lynch saving the player who was originally in the lead,
the lynch save will fail.
Lynch save will only reveal that the player was lynch saved.


If player X is holding the keys and chooses to give them away on the same night that the indy targets him for the ODTG kill, does the indy win? If player X chooses to give the keys to a player who gets targeted for the baddie NK that night, does the original player keep the keys or do they go to the baddie NK carrier?

The indy doesn't win if that happens
The baddie nk carrier will get the keys.

Thinking about that, the Indy's win will be hard to achieve because players could just give em to other people and by that clear other players as the indy. I am thinking that the block should be able to block the key exchange as well.

hmm maybe it should be a day kill... or idk


There is also something that I don't want to post publicly about the design so I'll PM you.

I will get to em in a few hours! Thanks for your help http://mafiamaniac.org/smile/modhello.gif


I'm an educated man, I read various remarkable books, but I cannot understand the direction I myself want to go, whether to live or to shoot myself, as it were. So, in case, I always carry a revolver about with me. - Epikhodov

And perhaps we are funny. But you must never imagine, that just because something is funny, Monsieur le Marquis, it is not dangerous. - Mr. Croup

I have always felt that violence was the last refuge of the incompetent, and empty threats the last sanctuary of the terminally inept. - Monsieur le Marquis

There is nothing so dangerous for anyone who has something to hide as conversation!... A human being cannot resist the opportunity to reveal himself and express his personality which conversation gives him. Every time he will give himself away. - Agathe Christie
lolcat
*
Posts: 2316
Gender: Male 
Awards: 16

B: 2-4
G: 12-5
I: 2-3
O: 6-12
TB:
TG: 2-0
  Posted Jun 25 2017, 10:28 AM
QUOTE (Boquise @ Jun 25 2017, 06:16 AM)
I'm slightly wary of forcing Gubbey to kill N1 or N2 with such a small roster since Russel Crow ended pretty quick with two goodie kills, but a forced early kill probably helps with balance since there are only two baddies. Do the Gubbey mechanics only apply to his first kill (on either N1 or N2) and then he's a straight kill if he kills a baddie and therefore survives, or would he still die if he targets a goodie afterward? What happens if Gubbey targets the indy for a kill?

I was thinking that Gubbey keeps a regular Kill which he can use whenever and how much he wants to. So he would survive killing a Goodie at that time.
Hmm... I will see that as a non-goodie kill so it'd work like a baddie kill.
Another thing, going with my wordings I have observed this: Gubbey lives if he kills a baddie. That means that it won't count if he gets blocked or the target is saved. Gubbey dies if he targets a goodie. This means that he dies even if he gets blocked or the target is saved. Thoughts on that? It could make Gubbey learn the ID of a baddie/the indy so maybe not good.


Well, it depends on what happens to Gubbey if he targets a baddie/indy for a kill but they don't die. If Gubbey attempts the kill N2 on a baddie/indy but it fails because of a block or save and Gubbey wakes up dead because of not killing by N2, then no one learns who he targeted as baddie/indy. If he survives as long as he attempts the kill on a baddie/indy and can out his target D2 then the baddie/indy will probably get lynched D2, but the baddies are still better off having the player get lynched D2 instead of killed N2. So it seems reasonable to me either having Gubbey die or letting him live if he targets a baddie by N2 but the kill fails.

Altho... what would the NP show if Gubbey targets a baddie (or for that matter a goodie) who gets saved?
A) If Gubbey dies as long as he doesn't successfully kill a baddie: It would probably be fine to show a Gubbey kill attempt on his target and them being saved, plus Gubbey killing self, because that wouldn't reveal whether his target was a goodie or baddie.
B) If Gubbey survives as long as he targets a non-goodie: If the baddie appears to be saved from a Gubbey kill and Gubbey's death doesn't show up in the NP then that outs Gubbey's kill target as baddie with the night post. If Gubbey targets a goodie who gets saved N2 then I'm guessing the NP would just show Gubbey killing the player that is Gubbey -- if it were to show the Gubbey kill attempt and/or the save on his target and then Gubbey killing himself then that would out his target as goodie.

Also: if Gubbey fails to kill a baddie by N2, can he be saved from killing himself by the save? I'm thinking you don't want the suicide to be saveable.


If player X is holding the keys and chooses to give them away on the same night that the indy targets him for the ODTG kill, does the indy win? If player X chooses to give the keys to a player who gets targeted for the baddie NK that night, does the original player keep the keys or do they go to the baddie NK carrier?

The indy doesn't win if that happens
The baddie nk carrier will get the keys.

Thinking about that, the Indy's win will be hard to achieve because players could just give em to other people and by that clear other players as the indy. I am thinking that the block should be able to block the key exchange as well.

hmm maybe it should be a day kill... or idk


Maybe just have kills happen before key passing in the order of events. Although now I'm thinking that any clues in the NP* as to who has the keys might potentially break things: if it can be figured out too easily then people will have to lynch whoever holds the keys so they get redistributed before the night phase to keep the indy from winning.

*If the clues are in the NP and not just PMed to the indy

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