Welcome to MafiaManiac, a site is dedicated to the growth and expansion of the online forum game of Mafia.

Mafia is that party game you may have played, where there is a mafia (informed minority) trying to overtake an entire village and the villagers (uninformed Majority) are trying to stop them. We play these mafia games over several days in our forum and we have people from all over the world playing them. These mafia games can be themed from movies, real life situations and almost anything you can think of! Mafia involves a lot of creative strategy, making you think on your toes. You'll be forced trust your gut, check your logic, and deceive or be deceived. If you think you can handle playing, here are a few links you should definitely check out.

- Unreality's Official Guide to Mafia
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Also registering and replying to my welcome message with how you found this site without me asking you to will get you 2 rep points, which is very helpful later on.

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GMaster479
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 Mafia Wager
Giovane D'Honore
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 04:32 PM
QUOTE (plasmid @ Mar 8 2015, 02:57 PM)

... If you were really bound and determined to cheat in one of those games, you'd have to do things like give another player your login password, or physically give them your laptop, to let them view your entire account and verify that you're telling the truth ...


Or simply make a screenshot and send it over a private message...

I think I remember a game that allowed even this. You could send screenshots, or even give people passwords in some situations. And the game could still go on, it was awesome...
Monsieur
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 05:00 PM
The problem with that is that is not balanced for baddies. Baddies can not show such screenshots nor can they give away their passwords, since they don't have the evident "you are goodie" PM; they have the "you are a baddie" PM instead.

I don't really understand the appeal in showing people your role message and that kind of private information.


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lolmod
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 05:12 PM
Screenshots can be forged, just like quoting a PM can be forged, which is why I figured that it would be necessary to actually let someone access your account to be sure.

If you thought people were likely to do that sort of stuff, I'd (as a host) offer to send baddies a second PM that looks exactly like a goodie's role PM, and make it known that I'll do that, so people couldn't gain an advantage from showing one. And a well designed game should have a disincentive for outing so that if someone demanded to see your role PM you would just reply with something like "how do I know you aren't a baddie who'll just use it to RID kill me?" whether you're goodie or baddie anyway. There would still be issues if someone were to end up being proven to be a goodie (getting saved from the NK or something) and were to demand that everyone claim a role to him through an illegal channel of communication; it's not something I've really thought about how to address since it doesn't seem to be an issue here.
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 05:15 PM
QUOTE (Boquise @ Mar 8 2015, 09:00 PM)
The problem with that is that is not balanced for baddies. Baddies can not show such screenshots nor can they give away their passwords, since they don't have the evident "you are goodie".



That was the whole point of this other game.

It was a custom made Web app game. The correct informations about all roles are stored on the server.

On the client-side, in the browser, the user has a Role Picker where they could select any role as their 'acting role'.
On initial login, player's true role is pre-selected as the acting role. After that, a player can change it depending on which role they wish to pretend to be...

When submitting actions and votes... only the votes and actions submitted while user is assuming his authentic role are considered valid and produced actual results.


This way, any user can produce any kind of screenshot or show laptop to other users. The other users have no reason to believe that what they are seeing is the player's authentic role.
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 05:33 PM
QUOTE (plasmid @ Mar 8 2015, 09:12 PM)
Screenshots can be forged, just like quoting a PM can be forged, which is why I figured that it would be necessary to actually let someone access your account to be sure. If you thought people were likely to do that sort of stuff, I'd (as a host) offer to send baddies a second PM that looks exactly like a goodie's role PM, and make it known that I'll do that, so people couldn't gain an advantage from showing one..



I was thinking in a similar way.
But it seemed too much work. I figured it would be even better if the app where mafia is played has a mechanism like the one posted in my previous post.
It would make faking screenshots trivial and the gameplay would become almost invaunerable to logging into other peoples' accounts.
After that point noone would even try doing these things because they would know that it accomplishes nothing.


QUOTE (plasmid @ Mar 8 2015, 09:12 PM)

And a well designed game should have a disincentive for outing so that if someone demanded to see your role PM you would just reply with something like "how do I know you aren't a baddie who'll just use it to RID kill me?" whether you're goodie or baddie anyway.


If you are a regular citizen/townsman/innocent there shouldn't be any reason not to share your screenshot. So this limits your potential fake story as a player so you cannot say: "I am the normal citizen".
Because, then you have to produce a screenshot.



QUOTE (plasmid @ Mar 8 2015, 09:12 PM)

There would still be issues if someone were to end up being proven to be a goodie (getting saved from the NK or something) and were to demand that everyone claim a role to him through an illegal channel of communication; it's not something I've really thought about how to address since it doesn't seem to be an issue here.


The baddies would still claim that they are the goodies, even to a dead proven goodie.
For example, a proven goddie would receive all the claims and count: 6 citizens, 1 doctor, 1 detective, 0 mafia

And what can he conclude from that?

This post has been edited by acajic: Mar 8 2015, 05:34 PM
lolmod
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  Posted Mar 8 2015, 09:26 PM
Forging a PM is pretty easy, so I figured taking a screenshot of a forged PM would also be pretty easy. http://mafiamaniac.org/smile/idk.gif Especially here where phases last 24 hours.

I keep forgetting that other people tend to have multiple vanilla roles. But RID kills (or whatever anti-outing mechanism you choose) should prevent even a regular townie from claiming a role to a possible baddie/indy, as long as the baddies/indy can do extra nasty things to them if they know their role. What I had in mind regarding claiming to a known goodie was based on our play style where every role is a power role: if you force people to all claim to a known goodie then that goodie can say "Players W and X both claimed one role, and players Y and Z both claimed another role, so look there for your baddies."
THE TORMENTOR
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  Posted Mar 18 2015, 02:12 PM
Hey, I thought I was running this show. http://mafiamaniac.org/smile/scratch.gif


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  Posted May 5 2015, 06:27 PM
#1 - saying it is like the way we pay taxes even though there is a competing incentive there to not want to pay implies there is more incentive to cheat on mafia than to not cheat.

If you assume there is more incentive to NOT cheat than to cheat, then the problem goes away.
People who want to win at all costs are probably not suited to mafia. At the same time, taking that chance to cheat puts at risk your entire future possibility of playing and winning unless you find a new group to play with.

If you then look at it from the point of view of someone who wishes to continue playing mafia and enjoys it, and cares what people think of them, cheating becomes a very inferior option. The win/lose of cheating/not cheating doesn't pay out. Even if you are solely focused on winning and don't care what people think of you, you will spend your life having to find new marks to cheat. For what? Not for reputation...

#2 - Let's say you think "well people can cheat and get away with it" Yes they can. But have you thought further on?

Let's say you know who everybody is. Now you cannot use any of that information unless you can come up with a way that you could have known it. If you're too smart, game after game, it will become obvious. So now you have to spend all your "game energy" not on working out what role is what but on working out legitimate ways that you could have worked out this or that. Legitimate reasons to goodie kill a baddie. Legitimate reasons to tell everyone to move their votes. Legitimate reasons to convince the goodies they need to block player A and "DO NOT LYNCH THAT GUY!" (omg he is the role spy!)

You can't lynch a baddie by yourself and you can't kill a baddie until it is clear to more than yourself that they are bad. At least you can't get lucky N1 kills on a regular basis, maybe once or twice in a mafia career. You can't constantly kill off the save or the role spy N1 and then claim their roles without spying them.

To the proposed situation, if one person asked another to tell their role and the 2nd guy said "hey this guy cheated!" and the first guy said "BS, that's just his strategy to win the game." (Btw, how would that even be a strategy? Why would you want to get a friend banned from a website ANYHOW? Even for a person who wants to win all the time, I don't see the strategy for it. There will be other players that are hard to beat. There will be other players who can step into the mafia role that guy just stepped out of.)
But in that situation, it is easy. "You two know each other IRL and are playing mindf***s so http://mafiamaniac.org/smile/sadwave.gif and why did you bring that buffoon into our site, anyhow?"

In conclusion, for people whose main incentive is the fun you get in working out all the roles, cheating destroys that. For those who just want to win, you can't win if you can't keep playing and where is the achievement in cheating. The only positive would be to improve one's reputation but it would take a lot of work not to come undone and those who aren't sociopathic would be quite upset when all those that look up to them eventually see their true colours. (In my opinion.) Cheating ruins the cheaters enjoyment of the game or their ability to enjoy their win.

Polishing 30 MVPs for cheating is like the people who pay 100s of dollars to buy little icons in games. It is a picture that you did nothing to earn. How is that even worthwhile?


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  Posted Jun 2 2015, 05:18 PM
To me making a bet or wager on a mafia has only ever been possible with two people that have the same base knowledge, a duo of hosts or 2 people outside the game.

As a player in the game having a wager sort of draws away from what you're trying to accomplish in the game. Your goal goes from lynching baddie A to lynching baddie A to get some sort of neat prize.

As host you don't really have any pull in the game outside watching things happen so adding in a little bit more the pile might make it a bit more interesting.

But that's just the Nox 2 cents


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